Click to view attachment

Would you say that this man is 5'11", 158 lbs, has brown hair, wears dark glasses, and has a dark complexion?

Maybe.

The physical description provided above is not that of the Dark Complected Man, but of Manuel Rodriguez Orcarberro.

See 5/26/64 FBI Report of SA Wallace Heitman, page 5

http://www.maryferrell.org/mffweb/archive/...p;relPageId=223

Steve Thomas

I am not generally one for seeing people in the patterns of light and dark in the bushes (not that I disparage such searches), but I've always been amazed this photo doesn't get more attention. Is it just me, or is it pretty apparent that the dark-complected man is speaking into a walkie-talkie of some sort. The bulge in his hands is pretty blurry, but you can see the grey strip of the antenna against the suit of the person behind him.

The picture is from Ron Ecker's "The Umbrella Man" page: http://www.hobrad.com/acreumbr.htm

Rex

Rex,

The strip that looks like an antenna could possibly be an artifact in the photo. I say that because there is a similar strip visible halfway down the man's back. And there is another one under the left shoulder of the motorcycle cop.

But then that strip right where an antenna would be sure is coincidental, isn't it? I hate coincidences.

Ron

Only 4 hits for 'Orcarberro' at NARA. Wonder what Goss was telling 'Blakey' [sic].

ORIGINATOR : USSS
FROM : GOFF, ROBERT O.
TO : BLAKEY, G. ROBERT
TITLE : [No Title]
DATE : 05/17/1978
PAGES : 1
DOCUMENT TYPE : LETTER
SUBJECTS : RODRIGUEZ-ORCARBERRO, MANUEL
CLASSIFICATION : UNCLASSIFIED
RESTRICTIONS : REFERRED
CURRENT STATUS : POSTPONED IN FULL
DATE OF LAST REVIEW : 07/26/1993
COMMENTS : USSS 155-1. Box 155.

I don't seem to be able to find a photo for Orcarberro.

Well, I guess everybody has different eyes! I don't see similar strips in the other places you mention - in fact the one I'm talking about is about "halfway down the man's back" so maybe the one I'm trying to point out is the "other one" you're seeing.

And the strip I do see is "perfectly" located relative to the blob in the Dark-Complected-Man hand. Further, the strip doesn't go through the DCM's head (which an antenna wouldn't being behind his head), but shows up perfectly emerging from his head across the other person's back.

Okay, I guess I must be Black Dog Guy after all. But for whatever reason this one looks obvious to me, unlike all the other guys-in-the-bushes I've been exposed to.

Rex

Is there a clearer picture that does show the DCMs right hand where it is supposed to be
while holding the walkie talkie ? I mean one that is conclusive in regard of the hand ?

Here is my take on the antenna and his right arm.

Thanks to Gary Mack for the following:

The original Towner slides and movie film are at The Sixth Floor Museum, although she still owns them. Several years ago I did a very high-res scan of DCM and the "antenna" is, in fact, part of the picture - it is not an artifact. I can see the grain of the film and the silver highlight is not a scratch or any other defect.

To me, it looks like DCM might be bringing a transistor radio up to his ear. I suspect that if there were any pictures of him before the motorcade arrived, they would show he was listening to the live KRLD coverage of the motorcade on Main Street.

Gary Mack

_______________________________________________

OK, so I clicked on the link, Steve, and read the report and now I'm wondering which (earlier) report said that Rodriguez was "violently anti-Kennedy". Steve? James? Larry? ??
--Thomas
_______________________________________________

P.S. In answer to your question(s), I would have to say "yes" because DCM is, by definition, "dark-complected." He also obviously has dark hair (brown?) and is "lanky" (around 5' 11"; 158lbs?) Regarding the "dark" glasses, I think they can be seen in at least one of the other photos taken of him at that time.

(But what about Felipe Vidal Santiago? Isn't it equally plausible that he was DCM?)

--Thomas

P.S. Thank God that the woman wearing a dark coat/jacket was passing behind DCM when the photo showing so clearly the antenna of DCM's radio/"walkie-talkie" was taken! The antenna is so clearly visible! In my mind, anyone who looks at this photo must agree that there was a conspiricy!!

_______________________________________________

In the color Rickerby, the Cuban has switched the radio to his
left ear.

Jack

I missed the ORCARBERRO photo posted by James earlier. If that is him - doesn't seem to be much of a match for DCM.

Hi Lee,

I'd just like to reiterate that I am not 100% sure the photo is of Orcarberro. I tried to contact his daughter some time back for confirmation but she never replied.

James

More on the Cuban and his radio.

Jack

The Cuban, his glasses, his cap.

Jack

Was the Cuban packing a sidearm? Look at the shape of the bulge.

Jack

That is, without a doubt, the best view of DCM I've seen to-date. Thank you.

I'm not sure it is a sidearm, but it could answer (quite easily) the question I had which was: "if he's using a radio in the other photographs, where did it go?" Walkie-Talkies from that era were substantially larger than today's, and were not as easy to conceal. If one was pocketed or belt-clipped under the jacket, it could very easily look like this.

No question, though, there is something under that jacket (other than the DCM himself)!

_______________________________________

Frank,

In at least one of the other photos in which DCM appears (after getting up and walking away down Elm St.), he can be seen tucking somthing into one of his back pockets. Most likely the radio/"walkie-talkie."

--Thomas

_______________________________________




______________________________________

Excellent observation, Jack. Don't know why I didn't notice that before you brought it to my attention.

--Thomas

PS Go Frogs.

______________________________________

I favor a concealed gun in a canted holster.

Jack

__________________________________________

I was just thinking-- What a stroke of brillance by the conspiritors to have a dark-complected person working with a caucasian! They would appear, on face value, simply to be two complete strangers thrown together in a crisis. Especially given the racial politics and climate in '63 in the South. Comments?

--Thomas
__________________________________________



__________________________________________

P.S. I said Bernardo de Torres (as possible DCM) in an earlier post. I meant to say Felipe Vidal Santiago.

Sorry for the confusion. --Thomas

__________________________________________

There are many styles of "shoulder" holsters. More properly they
should be called ARMPIT holsters, and can be under either arm
depending on whether the wearer is right or left handed.

Jack

P.S. I said Bernardo de Torres (as possible DCM) in an earlier post. I meant to say Felipe Vidal Santiago. (Thomas Graves)

Hi Thomas,

It seems that researchers are split between DCM being Orlando Bosch or Felipe Vidal Santiago. I for one have swayed strongly toward Vidal for quite some time and his sidekick being Roy Hargraves.

I am going to be hard pressed to change my mind but over the last few months, another combination has been thrown into the mix, Evelio Duque and Jerry Buchanan. I present it here as just another possibility and as a combination of characters which are curious to say the least. These two guys worked together on a regular basis and the Agency had a keen interest in Duque.

Bottom line is that DCM was positioned right amongst the action and his behavior (pre and post shooting) was supicious to say the least.

FWIW.

James

Tosh Plumlee identified DCM to Jim Marrs and me as a Cuban he knew
nicknamed GATOR, because an aligator had bitten off two of his fingers.
Tosh?

Jack

___________________________________

Rex,

Exactly.

--Thomas

___________________________________




________________________________________

Sorry Ron,

Sorry to rock your (slightly) contrarian boat, but it is an antenna. (Thank God the woman wearing the dark coak was passing behind DCM when the photo was taken, otherwise the antenna probably wouldn't have shown up in the photo.)

--Thomas

________________________________________

Tosh Plumlee identified DCM to Jim Marrs and me as a Cuban he knew nicknamed GATOR, because an aligator had bitten off two of his fingers.

Jack,

There was a dark skinned Cuban by the name of Alvarez (First name unknown) who went by the nickname Gator. He was allegedly associated with a commando group called the Black Falcons. Tony Cuesta was supposedly also a member of this organization.

It was told to me that at the time of the assassination, Alvarez was in Miami. Like all information of this type regarding where certain people were on the 22nd of November 1963, one should treat it with a grain of salt.

FWIW.

James

________________________________________________

Looking at James' post #21 this thread, interesting to note that Umbrella Man's right ear and Jerry Buchanan's right ear both stick out at quite a similar, sharp angle, don't they? They also have very similar eyebrows, nose, and overall facial structure in my humble opinion....

--Thomas
________________________________________________

Do you have an Alvarez photo?

Jack

Gary Mack has convinced me that it is indeed an antenna. But I find it odd that no one seems to see or understand why I suggested it could be an artifact. Does no one else see an identical though smaller strip behind the cop's left shoulder, and another identical though smaller strip sticking out from DCM's back? I see remarkable coincidence in this photo any way you look at it. If it's an antenna, there are two coincidental artifacts in the photo that look the same, as if they're conspiring to make you think it's not an antenna. How did this happen?

It brings other weird things to mind, such as how did the older tramp happen, as if planted there to look like two or three different suspects, for no other purpose than to boggle people's minds. I doubt that he was a plant (he was probably Gus Abrams), which makes it so weird.

James, thanks for that photo of Buchanan. It's the closest match I've seen to that frontal view of UM. To me that frontal view looks nothing at all like Hargraves or Novel and virtually eliminates them. It does look like Buchanan.

Sorry, Jack, no.

James

DCM was packing more than a gun and holster under his jacket. In this photo it looks like he's packing Citizen Kane's sled Rosebud on his back. I'd sure like to know what it is.

Yes, if it were indeed a "transistor radio" why would he conceal it under his clothes? And the other guy is supposed to be one Louie Steven Witt with his umbrella hexing the President or whatever... please .... I think a kid could have come up with a better "story".

The story Witt told was that he took the umbrella to mock Kennedy for his cowardice over Cuba. The umbrella serving as a mute reference to British P/M Chamberlain's appeasement of Hitler at the Munich conference. Seems a rather obscure way to make your point, most people settle for a placard......

Thomas,

[/quote]
_______________________________________________

OK, so I clicked on the link, Steve, and read the report and now I'm wondering which (earlier) report said that Rodriguez was "violently anti-Kennedy".
_______________________________________________
[/quote]

The closest I've been able to come is a 1/14-17/64 Report from Dallas Secret Service Field Agent, Roger Warner. He says in his report on Rodriguez, "This investigation originated on a memo from PRS in reaction to a memorandum marked "Secret", subject, "Reaction by Cuban Exile Community to President Kennedy's Death." In this memo it is reported that one Manuel Rodriguez, who is currently living in Dallas, Texas, is known to be violently anti-President Kennedy."

http://www.maryferrell.org/mffweb/archive/...amp;relPageId=3

Notice the date of Warner's Report.

I would encourage you to read paragraph number 2. on page 3 of his Report.

ATTU Agent Frank Ellsworth was questioned about Rodriguez on 1/16/64.

Warner's Report is included in a 4/24/64 letter from SS Chief Rowley to J.Lee Rankin.

I have not yet found the original memo from PRS or the memo marked, "Reaction by Cuban Exile Community to President Kennedy's Death."

Steve Thomas

On page 4 of Rowleys letter (page 3 of Warners Report), it says, "Reproductions of photographs of subject obtained from the Immigration and Naturalization Service."

So we know photographs of Rodriguez existed at one time.

Steve Thomas

In Rowley’s letter to Rankin dated 4/24/64, he says, “The basic document in this investigation is a memorandum from the CIA to the Federal Bureau of Investigation – Special Agent in Charge (Miami Office) dated November 25, 1963…Rodriguez is also mentioned in FBI Report of SA William Mayo Drew of the Miami Office. FBI file number 105-112098.”

Go to the NARA Archives and do a standard search for 105-112098. Click on the entries of William Mayo Drew.

Here is what you'll get:

Mayo 10/24/63 RESTRICTIONS : 1A; DONOR RESTRICTION; REFERRED
CURRENT STATUS : RELEASED WITH DELETIONS

Moses Aleman 10/16/63 RESTRICTIONS : 4
CURRENT STATUS : RELEASED WITH DELETIONS
DATE OF LAST REVIEW : 09/14/1998
OPENING CRITERIA : INDEFINITE

Mayo 2/11/64 RESTRICTIONS : 4
CURRENT STATUS : RELEASED WITH DELETIONS
DATE OF LAST REVIEW : 09/25/1998
OPENING CRITERIA : INDEFINITE

Mayo 10/24/63 CLASSIFICATION : SECRET
RESTRICTIONS : 1B; 4
CURRENT STATUS : RELEASED WITH DELETIONS
DATE OF LAST REVIEW : 09/25/1998
OPENING CRITERIA : INDEFINITE, APPROVAL OF CIA



Grrrrrrrrr...

It looks like this file had something to do with Alpha 66 and the SNFE. Several times something called Plan Omega is mentioned.

Steve Thomas

I found this on ebay - a transistor radio from 1963:


This auction is for a vintage General Electric two band AM/SW transistor radio. Model P925. Was made in 1963. This is the First GE transistorized shortwave portable. Dimensions: 9” X 5.5” X3”[u].

Steve, if memory serves, Plan Omega was discussed in a couple of press conferences by
Alpha 66....it was part of their structured build up of off shore, sea borne assults which
would hopefully trigger a larger scale movement against Castro within Cuba. Alpha 66
was very specifically raising funds for these projects.

Fund raising and PR were very much part of their overall program....Omega was intended
to take their effort to its hoped for conclusion e.g. Alpha to Omega...

-- at least that's what jumps to mind, Larry

_____________________________________

Ron,

Excellent observation. I've looked at that picture many times, but hadn't noticed the "peaks" or protruberances at the top of his jacket near both of his shoulders until I read your post. They're so obvious now that you mention it. ..

Thanks, Thomas

PS And I wonder what that rather largish white thing could be which is just below his belt-line a little right-of-center?? Couldn't be his shirt, could it, because if it were then he's wearing his trousers way to low, IMO. Comments, anyone?

_____________________________________

[/quote]


I found this on ebay - a transistor radio from 1963:


This auction is for a vintage General Electric two band AM/SW transistor radio. Model P925. Was made in 1963. This is the First GE transistorized shortwave portable. Dimensions: 9” X 5.5” X3”[u].
[/quote]

Hi Mark.

Gary raises a valid point. There were transistor radios much smaller than what you have indicated. There is a photo taken during the aftermath where you can see the size. I don't know if I have it - Robin Unger has posted a copy before. Oops - found it. Credit to Robin on this one.

Me - I'd like very much to figure this out and get moving forward - with a good ID on both men, and proof that they were part of the operation. Don't know that this is possible in the short term - or long term for that matter. I do like James' post on Buchanan.

FWIW.

-lee

_____________________________________________

Mark,

The ideal size transistor radio to carry around under one's jacket. Not.
And by the way, the dimensions of the bulge under DCM'm jacket look significantly bigger than 9" X 5.5" X 3", IMHO.

--Thomas

_____________________________________________

_____________________________________________

Peter,

I totally agree with you on everything you say on this issue. If ever any evidence were needed to prove a conspiracy, it's the photos taken of DCM and TUM. It's so darn obvious...

--Thomas

_____________________________________________

A closer look.

Click to view attachment

I believe that what has been interpreted as a lump, possibly a gun and holster, in the side
of DCM's jacket was actually a bag. Based on Rickerby's photo, the photo below from
Robin Unger's site, and other photos, DCM was wearing a white shirt, light blue jacket,
and a white bag. The bag is obvious in this photo:

I was responding to Peter's remark that "no transistor radio was that big or that square." Obviously they came in different sizes.

MV

You don't know what the man is holding, you are only guessing. And yet you are utterly convinced that these photos prove a conspiracy? Wouldn't it be more prudent to simply state that the photos are suggestive of unusual activity and leave it at that? Have you ever served on a jury? Would you like to be convicted based on someone's hunch?

You can't tell anything with certainty from these fuzzy photographs.

MV

Yep, I agree with Marks statement, There certainly APPEARS to be something underhand going on, and I find Witts testimony of why he had the umbrella that day farcial, but as evedence this is interesting, not conclusive.

Larry,



Thanks. At the end of the day yesterday, I read up on Plan Omega. The cuban-exile web site covers it pretty thoroughly.

"Plan Omega calls for a renewal of guerrilla warfare and sabotage on a wide scale." - as opposed to a frontal assault as in the Bay of Pigs.

http://cuban-exile.com/doc_351-375/doc0358.html

see paragraph II

Steve Thomas

I supposed that what Gary has said could be one way of looking at the photo, but there are a couple of things that I wish could be made clear and the only person to do that is a man who walked away from the plaza never to be see again. For instance, if it is a radio ... it would be interesting to hear how it was that after witnessing such a tramatic event that this man would have had the ability to put all that aside and go for a radio? I might add that the transistor radios of that day that I have seen were very small - pocket size. This radio, if that is what it is, looks to be more elongated like a walkie-talkie type device. It would seem to me that for the antenna to be pointing in the direction that it does, then the alleged radio would be turned in such a way so to not be seen as the man would have the device to his ear so to be able to hear any transmissions coming over it, but instead it appears to be turned in the manner that a two way communication device would be used. I would need to see an early 60's transistor radio that has such an elongated shape.

Bill Miller

I see three operational possibilities for DCM:

1. He was there as a signaler, though Al Carrier and perhaps others have questioned why a visual signaler would be needed there by shooters.

2. He was planted there as a taunting message, a Cuban exile whom JFK knew or knew of and would recognize and (given also the nearby umbrella) would thus know why he was being shot. (I'm more inclined to believe the umbrella was a weapon, and perhaps a signaler was needed who was close enough to see that the fletchette had found its mark, though again the need for a signaler is questionable.)

3. He was a potential walk-up gunman or suicide bomber (hence the bag).

Mark,

It would be interesting to hand over the DCM and UM material to an unbiased jury and see what they decide. I speculate such a jury would unanimously conclude that both were involved. (ie.conspiracy)

The photo evidence is damning enough, especially the fact that they appeared to behave differently from almost every other onlooker AFTER the assassination occured. Add to this the fact that they subsequently disappeared into thin air (I don't believe the Louie Witt story) and what you have, in the absence of any further information on these two, is guilt beyond reasonable doubt, IMO.

Mark,
I agree, it would be interesting to have a disinterested group examine this particular situation. I have to disagree with you about the outcome -- their behavior is suspicious in light of what just happened in front of them, no question about it.

But what could a jury find them guilty of? Holding something that looks like a communication device? Seriously, what offense could you even charge them with? Not grieving? Not running for cover? Not being stunned by the shooting? They're just sitting there.

And many people blended into the crowd and into the mist of history that day, not just them.

You said "in the absence of any further information on these two, is guilt beyond reasonable doubt" - Mark, do you really believe that? Guilt beyond reasonable doubt?

The reason I'm hammering the point is that it's vital not to either maximize or minimize the importance of any particular detail without proof.

If you're willing to convict these two for just sitting there, I'm sorry, that leaves me speechless. Which may be a good thing.

Maybe you didn't understand my position .... if it was a transistor radio, then why only listen to it for a brief period of time for the DM is not seen using the radio at others points immediately aroud the same time frame. I believe it was a communication device.

Bill Miller